...and say no more. new heartfuls from beneful baked delights. spark more play in your day. this morning, my question. what would you buy if you had a spare $250 million? plus, we go back 50 years to revisit the march on washington and the artistic way newtown, connecticut, is moving forward. but first, obama versus putin. clash of the titans. good morning. i'm melissa harris-perry. is it just me or is it feeling a little cold war in here? >> i think we saw more rhetoric on the russian side that was anti-american that played into

some of the old stereotypes about the cold war contest between the united states and russia and i've encouraged mr. putin to think forward as opposed to backwards on those issues, with mixed success. >> that was president obama yesterday during a press conference at the white house, capping off a week where the news has been all about u.s./russian relations. on wednesday, the president announced that he would skip a planned one-on-one meeting with russian president vladimir putin. that was scheduled for next month. but the white house said that there has not been enough progress on major issues like nuclear arms and human rights to make a presidential meeting worthwhile. they also cited russia's decision to give asylum to u.s. leaker, edward snowden. the meeting was supposed to take place in moscow before the g-8 economic summit in st. petersburg. and the president says he'll

still attend the summit, rebuffing calls by lindsey graham to boycott the summit entirely, and also the 2014 olympics in russia as well. but there are increasing calls from advocates to move the olympics out of russia, unless the country reverses course on a new law criminalizing the position of quote/unquote, nontraditional sexuality. i'm ready to get up under my desk and curl up for an air raid drill. who knew mitt romney was kind of right about russia. >> this is, without question, our number one geopolitical foe. >> we all laughed at romney at the time, but russia does still look pretty threatening. now, not in a, we will bring nuclear annihilation kind of way, but a rather, we're still totalitarian, we don't particularly like you.

they have veto power on the u.n. security council and don't plant to give up any of it. so wanted? weren't we just resetting u.s./russia relations? president obama and dmitry medvedev were buddies. they conducted joint antiterrorism missions and released joint statements on iran's nuclear program and signed a new agreement to cut back on long-range nuclear weapons. the state department even made a literal reset button to present to the russian foreign minister. remember that? now, of course, the minister had to tell then secretary of state hillary clinton that her staff had mistranslated "reset," instead using the russian word for "overcharge." but still, still, still, look how friendly it all seemed. things have been downhill ever since the march 2012, when putin stepped back into the russian presidency. the relationship between the obama white house and the putin kremlin have been tense, to say the least. president obama made that clear in his press conference

yesterday. >> our decision to not participate in the summit was not simply around mr. snowden. it had to do with the fact that, frankly, on a whole range of issues where we think we can make some progress, russia has not moved. >> so russia has not moved on a slew of important issues. there's syria. putin has dug his heels in support of president bashar al assad, which started when assad responded to civil unrest inspired by the arab spring. there's the nukes question, questions on reducing the country's armed stockpiles have come to a standstill according to administration officials. and the kremlin has stopped offering arms controls. at this point, it's not worth having the two presidents sit down together. it seems clear, we may no longer be in the cold war, but it is not exactly a warm hug either. joining me now, julia ioffe, a senior editor at "the new republic," who spent three years

reporting from russia. jolani kalb. miriam elder, former and national security editor at buzz feed. she used to be the neuews burea chief in moscow. and dr. nina, senior fellow in the world policy institute. she's also the great granddaughter of former soviet premier, knnikita khrushchev. so lots of conversation this week about this chilly relationship between president putin and president obama. but why should we care? i'm sure there are chilly relationships between world leaders around the world. why is this one important? >> i think it's important, well, it's come to our attention, because of the whole edward snowden manhunt, but i think, otherwise, we wouldn't really be talking about a reset of a reset with a former cold war power. if anything, this is a

recalibration of a relationship that was set during the cold war and it's been over 20 years since and things have to recalibrate. russia and the u.s. don't run the world anymore like they used to and russia is kind of falling further and further behind on the global station. >> jolani, you're nodding to that. >> i think one of the things that's interesting is the dynamic here. and people have talked about vladimir putin's positioning as a strong man, how people see him, but i think he's also probably responding to the dynamics internal within russia, which is a very strong sense of their declining power in the world. i think that's been like a lens through which lots of things that there, projecting strength, and reminding people of a time where the country was at least respected, and if not respected, certainly feared. >> this idea of a declining russia does seem to be at odds with the kind of geopolitical realities, particularly related to syria and iran, that we currently see. >> well, actually, it is not. because russia is a declining power and it has just a few

levers of influence. a serious one, what used to be former soviet spaces. but there are very few little things that putin has power over swob he overstates that power. he really tries to pull out as much as he can out of what little that he has, and he does a good job. i completely agree with you. he also speaks to his own constituents and 140 million russians in the popular of russia, but a lot of russians who want russia to be back on the world stage. you also hear in moscow, we used to be killed in prison, but our parades were great. and that's how a lot of russians feel. >> so this is interesting to me, given that this week was really dominated by kind of russia/u.s. conversation, that did feel cold war in some important ways, and it did remind me of mitt romney saying in the debate, this is our primary concern, this is our

main issue, and really, it sort of evoked a sense of, what, you know, what decade are you living in, mr. romney. and yet this week seemed to reinforce the idea that russia is strategically, critically important. >> it's critically important, in part largely because of the security council veto. the u.s. really can't do anything on syria through the u.n. without some sort of russian agreement. and i think there's an understanding of that. but russia's role right now is basically like the great disrupter. the way of just making is sure that the west and the u.s. in particular doesn't do what it really wants to do. >> if we went back even farther than the most recent election and sort of debate moment of mr. romney, if weapon went back to president obama when he was running for the presidency in 2008, he was a big fan of bilateral talks. this is part of what he said would be part of the obama doctrine, a different way of doing foreign policy. but i want to listen quickly to condi rice, obviously, from the last administration, and what she said about the bilateral talks here. >> the president is absolutely right, not to go to moscow for

bilateral conversation with putin at this time. there's nothing to talk about. and the slap in the face to the united states of america, of giving asylum to edward snowden, the president absolutely cannot go to a bilateral conversation with vladimir putin. >> so there's always a little moment for me, when condi rice and president obama are on the same policy page that always makes me want to pause and say, let's talk about that. do you agree? >> absolutely. i think the reset was great. they got as much out of it as you could. they got the start treaty, the transit route to afghanistan through russia, but then, things started to kind of go sour around the time of libya. the russians felt duped. they had abstained from vetoing at the security council. they couldn't vote in favor of it, but they abstained and felt the u.s. did a lot more than they said they were going to do. on their watch, qaddafi was

killed. and the ambassador was harassed for months on the ground, in a very unprofessional, very sort of, this is not what states do to each other. and it went on from there. syria was a major irritant. and what you heard from the white house during this period was like, look, if you guys don't want to talk, there's lots of stuff going on in the world, there's the middle east, there's china. if you're not going to cooperate, we're going to allot less and less time for you. >> we dov have other things to do. the body language thing came up with the president this week -- actually, let's listen very quickly to what the president said and then i want to ask you about this. >> i know the press likes to focus on body language and he's got that kind of slouch, looking like the bored kid in the back of the classroom. >> i love that. sometimes the goes a little offscript and it's very enjoyable to watch. but sometimes when i watch president putin and obama, it does feel like almost like a

pannipan i manning up thing that's happening, and these two superpowers are saying, you want to talk, oh, i'm not going to talk, oh, yeah? is that part of what's happening here for president putin, because he's positioning for his people, that pulling out of the talks allows him not to do the slouching routine. >> i think that's true, but julia's also right. when there's going to be these talks, we know that 95% of this stuff is worked out beforehand anyway. so it's mostly show. so there's no backstory, nothing's been worked out. so they don't want to go there and have something that looks the like too much of the truth. but one thing i wanted to add, with the add of the reset, even when there was the reset, and even there was this prevailing notion that the administration was operating under, there were these kind of microconcerns, the kind of stress fractures that you saw. one of which i saw personally in 2010, which was the may 9th celebrations there, which are thunl

huge. much bigger than the fourth of july here, this end of the world war, that existential threat that ended in russia, 26,000 fatalities there. every head of state that participated in world war ii was there, except barack obama. and people took that as a real snub. and angela merkel was there, and had to be the most uncomfortable -- >> that wasn't a friendly moment for her. >> she was there and obama wasn't, and people did take that as a sleight. >> it was critical to remember the losses that the soviets experienced. when we come back, i want to talk a little bit more about the edward snowden question. being sixteen, alex thinks he's invincible. his dad knows he's not. that's why dad got allstate accident forgiveness. it starts the day you sign up. [ female announcer ] with accident forgiveness from allstate, your rates won't go up just because of an accident, even if it's your fault. call 866-735-9100 now.

kim and james are what you might call...overly protective. especially behind the wheel. nothing wrong with that. in fact, allstate gives them a bonus twice a year -- for being safe drivers. [ female announcer ] get two safe driving bonus checks a year for driving safely. switch to allstate today! call an allstate agent now and see how much you could save. now that the kids are out of the house, so are frank and sandy. hitting every flea market they can find. but the best deal so far... is the one from allstate. [ female announcer ] drivers who switched to allstate saved an average of $498 a year! how much could you save? call 866-735-9100 and find out. [ dennis ] let an allstate agent help you save. are you in good hands? [ female announcer ] call an allstate agent and get a quote now.

i don't think mr. snowden was a patriot. mr. snowden has been charged with three felonies. if, in fact, he believes that what he did was right, they be like every american citizen, he can come here, appear before the court, with a lawyer, and make his case. >> all right. so if there was any confusion before, we now know that president obama isn't a fan of nsa leaker, edward snowden. and he's especially not a fan of russia's decision last week to grant snowden asylum, shielding of from charges of espionage and theft. how much was snowden the final straw in this deteriorating relationship? >> i think he totally was the deteriorating straw. we've had a relationship that's within deteriorating for probably two years now, probably even before that, and i think it was the final sign of how bad the relationship has gotten, that it was so easy for russia to be like, okay, edward, come

hang out for us a little while. >> is it really that it was so easy. and folks who watch this show know that i've gotten in trouble for some of my critiques of edward snowden, although not critiques of what he released. in other words, i think the releasing is one thing. i think the seeking asylum is something separate. but if the roles were reversed, we would we have returned an asylum seeker? >> we would never have. and there were instances when the lord of war, even a movie was made with nicolas cage on that story, who allegedly, or now not allegedly, because he was convicted for that in new york city, sold arms the to all around the world. and russians begged to return him and said we'll deal with him on our own and what not and the united states didn't. so in some ways, the way russian fee s feel about it, the way putin feels about it, he has the right

to behave the way he's behaved. because he feels like the united states, it takes two to tango, and he feels that both of them are guilty of this kind of posturing that you brought up slightly earlier. if we even look at pictures that barack obama and vladimir putin are sitting together, putin is sitting like a branch. he makes up for the fact that he's probably 20 centimeters shorter than -- >> it's true. >> there is putin right there. look how manly he is! >> he does. it's slightly outdated deal of manliness to sit like this, but nonetheless, he does have this -- and so for him, it's give or take. that's what they used to call in the cold war, sum intelligence. so he feels completely justified in doing whatever he's doing. >> i like this, you taking us back to this notion of the zero sum mentality. because it is the thing that challenges sort of the obama doctrine on the capacity, in

other bilateral or multiparticularly talks to talk things out. are we in a zero sum place in this relationship with russia? particularly around edward snowden. >> well, some things that aren't very flashy and aren't very sexy, like the transit of pearl to afghanistan, we can talk about quietly. but the kind of sexier topics like syria and snowden, i mean, when you talk about a zero sum mentality, it's not just putin. it's something that permeates to every level of russian society, to russian business, to the way russians deal with each other. it's not a very trusting society. it's a very cynical society. like, people -- russians, especially, much like americans, project their own world view and their own approach to life on americans. they think it's also a zero sum gain for us and it's also just about money or it's also just about humiliating russia for us. they don't understand that americans really are kind of idealistic. they think it's ridiculous. they don't understand --

>> and even, when i was there, one of the thing people talk to me, why are you americans always smiling. why do you smile so much. a friend of mine said, we take that to be false. we take that to be a sign of duplicity, because no one's that happy. and so, but i do think, again on the issue with being zero sum, i think there are some things, in some ways, i think there are questions that are more complicated, especially around afghanistan, where they did have the cooperation, but at the same time, there was this resentment that the u.s. policy, the u.s. war in afghanistan had enabled, as a secondary effect, had enabled heroin transmission into moscow, which is a significant problem there. so it was like, okay, while people are going along with the u.s. and this issue of afghanistan, but what is the u.s. really doing about opium trends. >> we'll stay on this. everyone, stick with me, we'll talk a little bit more about the trust factor when we come back. i'm beth...

and i'm michelle. and we own the paper cottage. it's a stationery and gifts store. anything we purchase for the paper cottage goes on our ink card. so you can manage your business expenses and access them online instantly with the game changing app from ink. we didn't get into business to spend time managing receipts, that's why we have ink. we like being in business because we like being creative, we like interacting with people. so you have time to focus on the things you love. ink from chase. so you can.

i'm going to let you see some of my favorite footage. this is from the moment that we think of as the great kitchen debate. this is july of 1959 and it's nixon and khrushchev and they actually have a debate, if you remember this, about sort of consumerism and consumer products and sort of who has it better, in part because of who has the better kitchen. this is all pre-hgtv. i want to bring this up, because we've talked about kind of the global aspect and the question of political positioning, but there's also an economic question here. russia has the largest economy in europe. it is booming relative to our stagnant economy. is that part of the -- only relative to our stagnant economy, is that part of the swagger here? do we need them economically? >> if you look at the list of american trading partners, russia clocks in at 20. >> but is that precisely the problem?

like, do we want them higher? there's a growing middle class there that could buy american consumer goods? >> they're going to buy apple products anyway. and they're always going to be closer to europe, they're always going to have stronger ties with europe, especially economically. like, do we really want closer ties with russia? like, look what they do in europe, they get mad at the ukraine and turns off the gas and that affects slovakia and everyone's freezing in the winter because russia is mad at the ukraine. do we really want to be more dependent on a fickle, whimsical power like that? >> interesting. i wonder, because actually you have actual personal ties here, but i wonder if there's been a shift in the thoughts about consumption. the very sort of american notion that consumption equals freedom. and i wonder if that remains a critique of the actual american way of wondering what freedom is. >> it was. until gorbachev came in and sort

of until the late '80s and early '90s, there was an idea that once you build a consumer society, it's going to be a freer society. that really didn't work out. it didn't work out, not just for russia, it didn't work out for a lot of other countries. because now we understand better what capitalism versus communism is. so in this sense, it is correct. in another way, of course, big firms are doing very well in russia. mcdonald's. the bigger you are, the better you do. the smaller you are, the worse you do. and that goes back to russian ideology, human rights, and all these other things. basically, a small man does not have the right and does not have the power. and as for the kitchen debates and putin, and putin, nixon came into the soviet union with the idea, the power of butter is stronger than the power of guns. russia still believes that the power of guns, it's 60 years later. >> and i want to shift it just a little bit, because as much as

there was this debate about consumer goods that was happening in '59, now we're in a debate at human rights violations, which is really emphasized in the snowden and nsa question. i want the to listen really quickly to what the president said about the nsa yesterday. >> we show a restraint that many governments around the world don't even think to do. refuse to show. and that includes, by the way, some of america's most vocal critics. we shouldn't forget the difference between the ability of our government to collect information online under strict guidelines and for narrow purposes and the willingness of some other governments to throw their own citizens in prison for what they say online. >> so this is exactly the thing that progressives are not buying. they're like, no, mr. president, that's mostly a false distinction, the more that we move toward this nsa spying, the more that we're moving towards the very thing we've been in a debate about with countries like russia for a very long time. >> i think this is sort of a false dichotomy. i think we should be concerned about what the nsa is doing.

i think we should be concerned about looks at what the stasi did in east germany. i think those are very valid questions. at the same time, i think there's a real significant critique, and progressives do ourselves no favors by pretending that somehow or another, russia is a haven, especially when we look at what ana was saying, what she was saying about putin and the putin government before she was killed. and it still rings very true. she said that as a journalist, your life was in jeopardy, if you sort of made criticisms that the government felt that they didn't like. and so i don't think we should ignore that, because the implication is that we care more about american privacy than we care about russian lives. >> i think that's critical. went we come back, i'm going to talk about the fact that russia is -- i've got a very personal beef with at the moment, because some of their issues may keep me from having a vacation in february. when we come back. hey! yummm!

totally got it all! don't forget your favorites, girls. hey girls! the good ol'days when we could eat as we wanted. yes, but we are not 18 anymore. sometimes if i eat as i used to my digestive system gets out of whack. it's not easy keeping it working as it should. it's easy if you enjoy an activia everyday. mmmm... delicious! with the exclusive probiotic bifidus regularis, activia helps regulate your digestive system. put a smile back in your day! ♪ activia ♪ dannon so, if you're sleeping in your contact lenses, what you wear to bed is your business. ask about the air optix® contacts so breathable they're approved for up to 30 nights of continuous wear. serious eye problems may occur. ask your doctor and visit airoptix.com for safety information and a free one-month trial.

bjorn earns unlimited rewards for his small business. take these bags to room 12 please. [ garth ] bjorn's small business earns double miles on every purchase every day. produce delivery. [ bjorn ] just put it on my spark card. [ garth ] why settle for less? ahh, oh! [ garth ] great businesses deserve unlimited rewards. here's your wake up call. [ male announcer ] get the spark business card from capital one and earn unlimited rewards. choose double miles or 2% cash back on every purchase every day. what's in your wallet? [ crows ] now where's the snooze button?

a new law this russia prohibits the promotion of, quote, nontraditional sexual relations to minors. the law bans gay pride rallies and over public advocacy for equal rights. critics say it could also lead to more violence against gays or those perceived to be gay. the new law raises serious question about russia's role as host of the 2014 winter olympics and how the international community should respond. >> i want to just make very clear right now, i do not think it's appropriate to boycott the olympics. we've got a bunch of americans out there who are training hard, who are doing everything they can to succeed. nobody's more offended than me by some of the anti-gay and lesbian legislation that you've been seeing in russia, but as i said, just this week, i've

spoken out against that not just with respect to russia, but a number of other countries, where we continue to work with them, but we have a strong agreement on this issue. >> so few are calling for an outright boycott, but some gay rights advocates have called for the international olympic committee to move the 2014 games out of russia. or there's the idea from cid zigler, co-founder of outsports.com, ban russia from competing in its own games. nbc, as a broadcaster of games, has a major financial interest in what happens in the sochi olympics and i will only get a vacation in february if we are preempted for olympics coverage. so we want the olympics to go on. but joining me now from burbank, california, is cid zigler. thanks for joining us today. hi, cid. >> i want you to have your vacation. >> but not at the cost of, particularly of the safety and the rights and freedoms of lbgt athletes. so tell me about your plan and

how do you think russia is likely to respond to the idea of not being able to compete in their own games. >> well, everyone wants to compete in sports. and nobody wants to sit on the sidelines. the idea of boycotting the olympic games, i'm glad that the idea is essentially dead. it's not going to have -- the president doesn't support it, the usoc doesn't support it. look, bans have worked in the past to change human rights issues. it worked in south africa. it worked with qatar and saudi arabia. these are on racial and gender issues. and there's an opportunity here to begin a conversation that lbgt issues and their human rights are on par with those other things. so i think it's important to start talking about banning russia and other nations. russia is not the only country that has these horrible regressive laws against lbgt people. i think the olympics are a great opportunity to do this. >> it's interesting, obviously,

the olympics have had their sort of political moments. there's a moment in mexico city where they raised their black power fists. there's, of course, jesse owens in germany, his athletic prowess demonstrating kind of the lie that is naziism. but at the same time, i wonder -- i saw a couple of heads shaking when cid said, oh, bans work, i saw some heads shaking at the table. >> i think in some of those countries, it would have worked, but russia is a totally different beast. it's still in the sort of fallen empire syndrome. and i think if you just sort of try to yell at it, it kind of recoils into itself. i don't think that that kind of pressure will change the reality on the ground for gays and lesbians in russia. >> so cid, i'm wondering if there should be a larger -- in other words, when the ioc is thinking about when to place olympics, should human rights be one part of an equation? >> of course. if you ban russia from its own games, it's not as though they're suddenly going to change their law.

it has to be one small piece. i mean, think about in the world of sports, right now, today is the opening ceremony of the track and field world championships in moscow. so the olympics are one small piece of the conversation. of course, talking about human rights issues and selecting other nations, which the ioc has already started talking about. there has to be political pressure, mostly from inside, andic that's what a ban does. i think it puts political pressure from inside the country, so the russian citizens themselves, they don't want to sit on the sidelines for this. so this is just one tiny little piece of the kind of pressure we could put on countries to change their policy. >> i was actually talking to some russian gay friends of mine, and they don't agree with the ban. they say that like everywhere else, the only thing that works in fighting homophobia is people coming out and people realizing that their friend or their brother or, you know, somebody they went to school with is gay

and they're normal. and so while i don't agree with president obama, that he was -- that nobody was more offended than him -- >> that was kind of a weird moment. >> he's like, nobody's more offended, and i'm thinking, no, maybe just a few people are. >> i do agree with him, what does work better is gay and lesbian athletes going to the olympics, winning a bunch of medals, and showing that their sexuality in no way affects their athletic prowess. >> it's the jesse owens solution. i will come and demonstrate i'm not sub-human. >> this is the problem with the law inside the country. it doesn't just ban propaganda, it bans people even saying that gay relationships are on par with homosexual relationships or that homosexuality or homosexual relationships are normal and so it kind of criminalizes that process of coming out. it criminalizes the normalization of gay and lesbians. >> and i think, cid, we've got to go, but i do really want to say thank you for saying how

important it is that we not just think of this as a sideline, literally marginal, but rather that we see this as the kind of fundamental human rights conversation that we're having on the international stage. >> yeah, my calling a ban is just one piece of it. the most important thing is for athletes the to go and hold the flags and be proud. that is the most important thing. >> sig zigler, julia ioffe, and dr. nina khrushchev, thank you so much for being here. coming up next, my letter of the week is truly a hair-raising situation. about his mortgage, groceries, or even gas bills. kick! kick... feel it! feel it! feel it! nice work! ♪ you got it! you got it! yes! aflac's gonna help take care of his expenses. and us...we're gonna get him back in fighting shape. ♪ [ male announcer ] see what's happening behind the scenes at aflac.com.

from time to time on the mhp show, we find reason to wade into the thick of things on the subject of african-american women's hair. but this week, it was oprah winfrey demanding that we talk about hair on the cover of the september issue of "o" magazine, where her usually solo feature was upstaged by a massive, perfectly round afro. turns out oprah's own considerable head of hair got a

whole lot bigger, courtesy of a faux fro. her cover co-star was actually a 3 1/2-pound wig, designed we hairstylist to the stars, kim kimball, who coincidentally was also shocked this week along with the rest of us when another one of her superstar clients snatched her own hair right off. it was just a couple of weeks ago with headlines declared that beyonce gets attacked by a fan had us all clarifying that, no, it was a real fan, one that makes wind. well, beyonce decided to make sure that didn't happen again. she ditched the weave, chopped off her own hair, and revealed the new look on instagram, a short pixy cut. as an official member of the beehive, i've been enjoying the heck out of this hairy pop culture moment. until at the airport on my way back from kentucky this week, it got personal. which is why today's letter win need to have a small talk with the man in charge of the transportation security

administration. dear john pistol, it's me, melissa. yesterday, we listened to president obama offer us his assurances that the national security agency isn't interested in spying on ordinary people. which would have been a relief to hear if i wouldn't have had an up close and personal experience with the overreach of a completely different government agency. turns out it's not the nsa i need to be worried about, it's the tsa, getting up a up in the business of regular folks. and i mean all up in the business. listen, i am no stranger to pre-flight security screening processes. it's become a regular procedure for me, thanks to the weekly flights between new orleans and new york. and i'm grateful for the diligence of the tsa in doing the tough job of keeping us all safe. but this time, as i prepared to depart from the kentucky airport, i experienced, let's call it, a kink in that familiar routine. there i was, having just stepped out of the body scanner when something unusual happened. the tsa agent pulled me to the side and proceeded to examine my hair. and by examine, i don't mean a simple pat, pat, pat.

oh, no, we're talking about fingers all up through braids, scalp, tickling treatment. i was sent on my way feeling a little violated, and unclear about why, exactly, that particular intrusion was necessary. because if your $170,000 machine can see under my clothes, how come it can't figure out that i am not hiding a weapon in my braids? maybe it's time to recalibrate the machine. so let's be clear. i realize that this is an occasional occurrence in my otherwise privileged position, getting to fly around the country for my job. this isn't a stop and frisk, stand your ground, end of the voting right acts kind of problem. but it is one of the countless microaggressions endured by african-american women on a daily basis, especially since i'm not alone with those -- among those twrkted hair who have been singled out for hands--on treatment by the tsa. now, if i didn't know that beyonce flies on a private plane, i might have wondered if her new short hair had anything

to do with wanting to avoid her sister's experience of the tsa searching her hair last year. she took it all in good stride when she joked on twitter that she was a victim of discrim-fro-nation. but john, i understand the tsa's screening procedures are no laughing matters for you and you've got considerable, sensible reforms, trying to make tsa screening more security, and less security theater. so all i'm asking is that while you're rewriting that script, please consider who the tsa has been casting as potential villains, because we can agree that there remains the need for protection from a threat, but i'm here to tell you, you are not going to find it in my hair. sincerely, melissa. you know throughout history,

folks have suffered from frequent heartburn. but getting heartburn and then treating day after day is a thing of the past. block the acid with prilosec otc, and don't get heartburn in the first place. [ male announcer ] one pill each morning. 24 hours. zero heartburn. the beach on your tv is much closer than it appears. seize the summer with up to 50% off hotels at travelocity.

plays a key role throughout our lives. one a day women's 50+ is a complete multivitamin designed for women's health concerns as we age. with 7 antioxidants to support cell health. one a day women's 50+. with 7 antioxidants to support cell health. how can i help you? oh, you're real? you know i'm real! at discover, we're always here to talk. good, 'cause i don't have time for machines. some companies just don't appreciate the power of conversation! you know, i like you! i like you too! at discover, we treat you like you'd treat you. get the it card and talk to a real person.

bill wheaten is pretty picked off, mad, even, about sharks. and we'll get to that. but first, some of you might be asking, who's will wheaten. you might remember him from the '80s classic, "stand by me," or the series "star trek: the next generation" or on "the big bang theory." something wheaton have watched is discover channel's "shark week." an annual festival of awesome, full of information about sharks. information we're supposed to trust and believe. but wheaten is mad, because this year's "shark week" kicked off last week with a fake documentary, alleging that the megaladon, an ancient and massive super shark, that has been very, very instinct for a while, could still be alive. >> we're talking about a giant shark. that thing is enormous. if the shark that's in the nazi

u-boat photo is, in fact, the same shark that i photographed just after boat attack, that means there's been a 50-ton monster in these waters for over 70 years. >> yeah -- no. wheaten says discovery betrayed its audience by presenting a mockumentry as fact. he says, we tune into discover channel programming with the reasonable expectation that anything we're going to watch will be informative and truthful. we trust discover channel to educate us and our children about the world around us. that's why we watch it in the first place. so maybe we also watch for really cool images of sharks, but that doesn't make wheaten's point about honesty and truth any less salient. perception is powerful. it's a concern that was shared this week by none other than reince priebus, chairman of the republican national committee, who wrote of his concerns via letters to the heads of cnn and nbc entertainment, complaining about planned programming about hillary clinton, threatening not

to partner with either network in 2016 primary debates, nor sanction primary debates, which they sponsor, and claiming in both cases that the programming is a thinly veiled attempt at putting a thumb on the scales of 2016 general elections. joining me now, miriam elder, and npr media correspondent, david folklandflake, who is author of "murdoch's word: the last of the old media empires." so i feel a little silly starting with megaladon. but in connection with the hillary clinton moviegate, it does feel like there's this question of, can i trust media? can i trust where i'm supposed to be getting information? >> it's a very interesting moment, because the real question is truth in advertising. you know, there was a little bit of a caption that flirted by at the very end of that hour that said, by the way, don't really believe any of this. we have nothing to do with it. people may have been actors. don't worry about it. it was so quick, no one could

really see it and it certainly wasn't advertised that way. in a sense, what discovery was doing here, "shark week" is entertainment, it wasn't saying these are all truly documentaries, and if people come to this with an idea of entertainment purely, and not the idea that these are all scientifically rigorous, maybe they give it a pass. but you have no way of knowing that as a viewer. >> amy, i want to ask about that notion of entertainment versus information. because we do have some statements from nbc news and nbc entertainment. and they are completely separate things, right? so nbc news says, nbc news is completely independent of nbc entertainment and has no involvement in this project. nbc entertainment writes, "nbc entertainment has many projects in development and this particular mini series, which has nothing to do with the nbc news division, is in its very early stages. a script has not been written nor has it been ordered to production. it would be premature to draw any conclusions or make any assumptions about it at this time." but you can see how folks would think that nbc news and nbc

entertainment have to do with one another. is it because of this massive corporate structure that is our media at this moment? >> first of all, i think the issue of this fake sharkumentry, people should see "blackfish," which is an independent story, a true story about the orcas in captivity at seaworld, and how they become killer because they're in captivity. it's an independent film and it's true. when it comes to nbc entertainment and nbc news, and sometimes i wonder, which is the entertainment and which is the knew. >> right, sure! >> on the issue of the series, what's -- i have a couple issues. one is, here is reince priebus saying, we're not going to collaborate with you on the primaries. i don't think that the parties and the networks should be collaborating. i think they should be independent. i don't think parties should be setting the rules that the audience doesn't know about on these primaries. and i think this should be exposed at this point. number two, on this, i don't think it's just a republican/democrat thing.

obviously, the republicans want to make a big deal about this, because they don't have a lot else to make a big deal about when it comes to their successes is. but i think it's interesting that david bronc is also uncertain about this, because a series, this mini series, is not necessarily, and that's why i was a little surprised at reince priebus' approach, is going to be positive about hillary clinton. i mean, there are a lot of issues, especially if you're into the entertainmenting inga things, that she doesn't want necessarily exposed. and i wonder if the clintons are for or against this. >> i want to take a moment. i think this is one of the few moments in life when i have general overarching agreement with paribfre priebus, but i waw andrea mitchell responding to this shall. >> you've been involved in debates, debate prep, debate negotiations, and here you've got the republican chairman, i would say understandably, miffed about these hillary clinton films, one a documentary, the

other an entertainment film, which is all about -- >> a bad item. >> a movie. >> and a lot of news people would say, including nbc news people, including chuck todd and all the rest of us, a really bad idea, given the timing. >> that somehow, whatever the content of it, it feels like a really bad idea in this moment for a news organization to be producing entertainment about a potential candidate. >> but, just to add to all the confusion, yesterday, "the new york times" broke that fox -- >> right, i love this? >> that a vision of fox may actually join in as a coproducer of the hillary clinton -- >> this is my favorite wrinkle in the story. >> so everything that sinks must converge. and i definitely think that media consolidation, which we've been keeping an eye on for 20-plus years, is a causing strange bedfellows, but this may be the even strangest. so is reince priebus going to go out against fox if they come in as a coproducer?

>> i don't know! that would thicken the plot. >> i've got to say, we have to acknowledge here that republicans are doing this, not just simply thinking about nbc. and obviously, nbc news itself would not be a producer. >> right, it's nbc entertainment. >> and you can understand the frustration of chuck and of andrea, they say, look, we're not going to win no matter what happens on this one. but this isn't just done in the vacuum of nbc news. this is done with this very channel, msnbc, and the liberal identity that is attached to it, for good cause. you know, if you think back to the 2008 convention, you know, on the floor of the republican national convention, people were, you know, in st. paul, chanting, you know, nbc, in a disparaging way. reince priebus is saying, either you guys at nbc are going to look like you're just republican bashers or you're going to look, as though you've caved. >> i think this is so important. there's an nbc entertainment

division, there's an nbc news division, there's msnbc. many of us who work at msnbc might have various opinions about the embrace of progressivism or liberalism on the channel overall. and certainly, when you have journalists like chuck todd or like andrea mitchell, i think they would sort of firmly reject the idea that they themselves are operating with a sort of ideological debate, but because they all say nbc, it becomes very easy to lump them into a pop and say, nbc is creating hillary clinton propaganda. i promise, so much more, more coming up next. stay with us. ♪ [ villain ] well mr. baldwin... it appears our journey has come to a delightful end. then i better use the capital one purchase eraser to redeem my venture miles for this trip. purchase eraser? it's the easy way to erase any recent travel expense. i just pick a charge, like my flight with a few taps, it's taken care of. impressive baldwin. does it work for hotels? absolutely thank goodness. mrs. villain and i are planning our...

you scare me. and i like it. let's go what's in your wallet?

welcome back. i'm melissa harris-perry. when president abraham lincoln greeted harriet beecher stowe in 1862, the civil war was already raging. and he reportedly told her, "so, you're the little woman who wrote the book that started this

great war." sure, president lincoln's greeting was a bit of an overstatement, but what he was referring to was a series that stowe had written for the national era, a newspaper issued weekly out of the district of columbia for over a decade. that newspaper series that stowe published later became the book that we know as "uncle tom's cabin." and as far as starting wars with the written ward, the spanish american war is sometimes referred to as the general's war, because of how williams hearst used his newspaper to stoke passions against spain in the 19th century, with little to no evidence to back up his claims. since the country's origins, newspaper have been and still have a critical institution in our culture, helping to shape public opinion. and there is a public trust enhernt in their power to impact action. perhaps no example is more famous in our modern times than the two reporters from "the washington post," who broke the watergate store in the early 1970s, helping to bring down a president. the reporting by bob woodward

helped solidify. this week, amazon.com founder, jeff bezos paid $250 million for that giant. $250 million to own an institution. that is less than 1% of his net worth, according to "forbes." less than 1%. also, last saturday, "the new york times" company sold "the boston globe" to red sox owner, john henry, for $70 million, a fraction of the $1.1 billion "the times" paid for it 20 years ago. when these crucial pillars of the fourth estate, institutions that have earned the public trust, and through that trust, hold great power, when they change hands, we're left to wonder what their new billionaire owners intend to do with them. joining me again are journalism professor, miriam elder of buzzfeed, amy goodman of democracy now, and nbr's david fowlkenflik. so what are we to make of the

acquisition of "the washington post"? >> this is going to keep happening, first of all. if you watch on a much smaller scale, you have tech money buying "the new republic." and i think what we're going to see is the start of a decade of realignment of media, which is viewed as a muffoney-losing proposition, with the people who have deep pockets. so that's going to be tech money, real estate money, edge fund money, possibly, but i think that basically what we're seeing is a huge fiscal devaluation of media. when "newsweek" was sold, before it was daily beast, it was sold for a dollar in debt. like $40 million in debt to an entrepreneur. so from a fiscal standpoint, this makes sense. from a journalistic standpoint, the question is, who's going to educate people from the tech industry and other industries who have money about what journalism is and what it should be. and finally, what i would say, i wrote an open letter to jeff bezos, just sort of urging a look at diversity. because the circulation of "the post" has dropped in half, like

over the past decade or so. and "the post" has never really kept up with the racial and economic and cultural diversity of washington, the city, or the beltway region, not just capitol hill. so all of those things are on the table, but we're going to see more of this. >> on your point about sort of educating what journalism is, i keep thinking, the amazon model, and it's not going to say that bezos is going to bring in the amazon model. the amazon model is a speed acquisition, and it's about how quickly you get it out there, it's a volume model. that's what's made them sort of the masters of the retail internet universe. how quickly they can get it to you and how many different things. that's really different than journalism. >> i recommend everyone to read matt mcclellan's speech. the issue of the questions that should be asked of jeff bezos, in addition to what farai is saying, in 2010, amazon dumped wikileaks as their server to be able to use it.

they just clinched a deal earlier this year for -- for a $600 million deal with the cia, for a cia cloud. what kind of questions will "the washington post" be allowed to ask about the nsa and spying, with a close relationship bezos has with the central intelligence agency. >> so to the extent that the fourth estate is supposed to be the thing that uncovers information, this relationship strikes you as deeply problematic? >> yes, and i think these are the questions that have to be raised. not to mention, what is jeff bezos want in washington? one of the ways amazon has grown tremendously at the expense of independent bookstores and corporate bookstores all over the country is this tax-free online sales. and these are the kind of issues he presses for. he says he's not going to have to do with content, but we all know how newsrooms work. he doesn't have to walk into the newsroom and say, melissa, i

don't want you talking about this. journalists know how they get ahead in a newsroom and how they get marginalized. >> newsrooms work according to their culture and the culture they're steeped in. if he retains the culture, there's the possibility that he will go on. if you look at the masthead, it says, "the washington post" and the independent newspaper. it is in a sense independent, but independent of what? jeff bezos, a huge constellation of business interests. and at the same time, you know, on the plus side, he brings, if not the amazon mojo, you know, of the company, because he's doing it as an independent investor. he brings a mind-set that says, i want to be exquisitely attuned to what people and customers think. now, if you look at buzz feed, they've interpreted that in a very specific way. he may not do it with speed. he may say, our customers need quality depth and context, but we don't know what he's going to do, because he doesn't know what he's going to do yet. >> this question about speed and depth and context, and also farai's point about the issue of diversity and the point about

independence all sort of find themselves in a quirky place when we're talking about not traditional print, but getting your news particularly from online sources, where speed is at the core of it, where the kind of little "d" democracy of it means that more people can enter into the information gathering and expression business. in the end, is the acquisition of an old-fashioned newspaper worth, even worth $250 million, even if that's not much for him? >> "the washington post" as an institution, i don't think anybody would want to see it go. if this is the way to save it, this is the way to do it. if he can adapt it to the modern age, where he can understand that news these days, it's also part of a conversation. people are living online, people are living on twitter, and people want to see the things they're concerned about, be that more diversity, and talking about issues responding to power. i think we also saw quite a bit of schizophrenia around "the washington post" and the nsa stuff. you had reporting on the nsa. they were one of the biggest papers, one of the two papers

alongside the guardian to issue the leaks. you had editorial pages saying, hold on, we have to stop these leaks. i think as long as there's an adaptation to what the american public wants, then, yeah. >> but i'm not sure that -- so, i hear you on what the american public wants, but that always makes me a little bit nervous, only because part of what we choose from is a menu of options that are there. and so, this is part of some of the independent media piece, right, to the extent that independent media gets squeezed, i'm not sure that people are making -- it's like, the american public wants reality tv. well, no, reality television is what's on. so you pick which one of them you want. i guess that's my only concern, do we even have on our menu, independent, long-form sort of deep, in-depth journalism? >> we do, if we seek it. the reality is, and i think, you know, the rise of buzz feed exemplifies this, and also in some ways the rise of democracy now is that you can have very

strong brands that develop very strong followings based on open markets in media. but what we don't really have is that town hall function that we used to. and newspapers used to be part of that kind of town hall, all-american -- like all americans used to watch presidential debates or most, you know, most americans used to watch the nightly news. don't really anymore. and newspapers also used to be that, like that gathering space. of course, that gathering space was never completely fair. so you see black americans, gay and lesbian americans, all these other groups written out of, you know, the news. so you have satellite publications that dealt with other communities' needs. what i would love to see, "the washington post" realize that it's in a majority/minority city, that it has to attract -- i mean, they've had internal reports for years saying they have to attract more latinos, stop the hemorrhaging of the african-american readers. they can do by reporting on the city in which they live, more in depth. and still do the political news

that's national and international. but if they want to keep some kind of hometown advantage, they're going to have to figure out whose hometown they're in. it's not capitol hill. it's chocolate city. >> t"the washington post" very much reflects the bipartisan consensus in washington. i know a lot is made of the gridlock, but i think it's much more about the consensus. and i think most americans fall outside of that. i mean, they've got to start covering the silenced majority, not the silent majority. i mean, i think we're talking about not a fringe minority or a silent majority, but the silenced majority, silenced by the corporate media. and that includes -- >> so play that out for a little bit. when you say the consensus, you're talking about the things that are simply off the table for conversation -- so there's a set of things we fight about -- >> -- democrat and republican representatives in washington, d.c., that so often leave out most americans. they'll also talk about the bickering. but, for example, just in the last few weeks, we have seen a remarkable "yes" consensus that's around the nsa. i mean, you've had the bill that

was introduced by conyers of michigan, republican and democrat. they got very little coverage in this country. it did lose, but by a very small percentage. you can be sure that president obama paid attention. but we are seeing something else rise that the corporate media has not reflected. >> and yet if you talk to people who have been involved in running "the post" and "the post" companies as i have, and talk to people who are their competitors, the major issue besetting them is they have been a hyperexample of the newspaper industry in general. they used to be the masters of penetration, which is a number of households in a major metro area that pay for the paper to get home every day. they've fallen off a cliff in terms of circulation and the advertising rates have similarly plummeted, so they're not a profitable newspaper. should they be covering the question of the city, like the district as a city better? perhaps they really should. but that's not entirely what their decline is about. they are in this interesting fight, both as a local publication and as a national one, with things like politico, things like buzz feed, that are

eating their lunch around the edge, and they haven't been able to solve it. a guy like jeff bezos might. >> that is the town hall issue that took the new orleans time picayune off my front step. on the one hand, i can't do a golden age of the times picayune, a paper that always had a variety of issues around ideology and diversity, but on the other hand, in a city that so desperately needs coverage of our elected officials, that so desperately needs coverage of our murder rate and that sort of thing, when that goes away, and instead, so you now have to seek it out. >> i think it's time to recruit a billionaire to buy "the times-picayune." i was like, seven days a week, let's get "the times-picayune" up to seven days a week. >> jeff, i'm telling you, you canic up "the times-picayune" way cheaper than "the washington post." stay right there. up next, the real new media, where cutting edge coverage meets cute, cuddly animals. seriously. when we come back. [ sneezing ] she may be muddling through allergies. try zyrtec®.

powerful allergy relief for adults and kids six years and older. zyrtec®. love the air. so you want to drive moreolder. safely? of smart. stop eating. take deep breaths. avoid bad weather. [ whispers ] get eight hours. ♪ [ shouts over music ] turn it down! and, of course, talk to farmers. hi. hi. ♪ we are farmers bum - pa - dum, bum - bum - bum - bum ♪

[ male announcer ] that's why there's ocuvite to help replenish key eye nutrients. ocuvite has a unique formula not found in your multivitamin to help protect your eye health. ocuvite. help protect your eye health.

. for all the attention paid to the change in ownership at "the washington post," newspapers are no longer the main or even a main source of public information. t there are now thousands of outlets vying for your attention. that's why websites like because feed also has lists of 20 adorably awkward yearbook photos of pop stars. yes, that's real thing on buzz feed right now. just wait until you see drake and lil' john. yeah! okay, it's also why news organizations from "time" magazine to "the huffington post" to nbc had stories about the brand-new live 24-hour feed of giant pandas -- they're so cute -- courtesy of china network television. pandas! right now, the panda is just sleeping. yep. that's not exciting. but sometimes it takes the silly stuff and the fun stuff, and the

stuff you just can't tear your eyes away from to get us to pay attention to the serious stuff. and hey, we here at nerdland aren't above it, so we're going to keep the cute little pandas right on screen, right there, throughout the whole segment. so this is like our buzz feed moment, this idea that -- so to your point about what consumers want, the truth is, we are trying to put together the show this morning and productivity dropped to zero, because we started looking at panda cam, right? or if you're going to go down that rabbit hole of the other stuff on the side. >> that's the thing, people look at it. and i don't though. i've started to think that maybe we should compare these things less to newspapers and more to television channels where you can watcher "the simpsons" and then watch the news. this is the way the world works. people want to get all sorts of content from one site. we all have senses of humor and we're all deeply interested in politics and that's okay. >> but there's a thing an measuring our success by clicks, by page views, even by subscribers, by ratings, that makes me wonder if we can ever

judge it we content. >> i say, go, pandas! >> okay! >> the fact that so many people will be or are already watching these pandas in china, and there are other links to the edinburgh zoo and other places around the world, is so important. people love, they revere these little animal, and nature if and if we then make the link to climate change, for example, the fact that these adorable, precious, threatened pandas in china could lose the food that they eat, the bamboo, by the end of the century, this is being raised by chinese scientists and scientists around the world, the fact that a stanford university study just said that we have not seen the climate warming like this in -- since -- in 65 million years, 9 to 11 degrees fahrenhe fahrenheit, our temperature could increase by the end of the century. i think the pandas could be the key to this. >> i love this. it's now like, go, pandas, for

the pandas' own sake. i love hearing you say we love the pandas and they're adorable and we revere them, so that helps to move us in a particular policy position. it also helps me think about the respectability rights of the civil rights movement, what if you're not a cute, cuddly animal. what if you're endangered and kind of slimy and reptilian? i still worry -- >> trying to bring us back to "shark week" again? >> right, right. but seriously, that's part of what happens with that mockument ry, that some kind of animals get pushed out of our public consciousness, because day don't look like that. >> but they are a way of warning the world to what's happening. and i think that is very important. and i also think, i mean, it's a way to challenge sound bite media. i have never felt that people's attention span, even kids' is like 8 or 9 seconds. that's what the corporate media gives us. you give people something interesting, and they will watch and they will watch, and they will watch. you play the full speeches, for example, that's going to come up

on the march on washington, and people will be fascinated. >> so the goal is to become sufficiently interesting and compelling, that we become like the pandas. in that sense, something that people, in fact, want to spend time with and learn something. >> please, go ahead. >> i was going to say, i think it's more of the exception than the rule. but down in washington, when they bring pandas over to the washington zoo, the federal washington would shut down and watch them. it's like they were royals, they were obsessed with it. that was fine. you could slice that in environmental issues, in terms of foreign policy, and whether they were papering over tensions between chinese and the u.s. that's all fine. it gets back a little bit to where we were talking about, about what people want, though. a great news organization provides people what they want, what they need, and what they didn't know they wanted. and a combination of this that can be substantiative and silly and diverting, but done intelligently, it's a question of the menu being complete. not that the menu isn't ever interesting in a more frivolous way. >> and a little bit of frivolity doesn't necessarily -- isn't a zero-sum game.

>> as long as the other stuff is in there. >> i think, to me, i see it more of a narcotic. just like people, basically, going through their lives, bored or just otherwise apathetic. and i love pandas, don't get me wrong. >> who doesn't love that panda? >> but i don't see it necessarily as transformative. i think people are just looking for relief from the everyday stresses, and it's going to be difficult to -- >> but you could be surprised, because, if, in fact, then, the networks will do spin-offs and everything, well, what if the panda doesn't have that boamboo? how do these pandas exist? how do we all exist? that's the question. >> and i've been following a lot of the environmental issues in china. because, of course, there's this dam building that's going on. and all sorts of parts of china are being urbanized, new cities are -- i mean, it's really astounding what's going on in china today, with enormous government pushes to subsidize the building of cities, ending the rights of some farmers, et

cetera. >> and people are dying in china and the united states as a result of extreme weather. we've got to hear those words, climate change. >> i don't have as much faith that the narratives will be connected. i think they can be, but i'm not sure -- >> so it allows us to keep the adorable panda cam, but also do the work of making the connections to what is important. maybe we'll just keep -- maybe we should keep panda cam up when we do our interracial conversation tomorrow. because it's like, is there black and white? >> and when we show the flooding. miriam elder and david folkenflik, thank you so much. and up next, we'll take you behind the scenes of the march on washington, as we approach the 50th anniversary of this historic event. mom always got good nutrition to taste great.

she was a picky eater. well now i'm her dietitian... ...and last year, she wasn't eating so well. so i recommended boost complete nutritional drink to help her get the nutrition she was missing. and now she drinks it every day. well, it tastes great! [ male announcer ] boost drink has 26 essential vitamins and minerals, including calcium and vitamin d to support strong bones, and 10 grams of protein to help maintain muscle. and now boost comes in two delicious, new bars. look for them next to boost drinks. [ dietitian ] now, nothing keeps mom from doing what she loves... ...being my mom. in two weeks, this nation will begin celebrating the 50th anniversary of the march on washington for jobs and freedom.

that march saw more than 200,000 people peacefully gather in our nation's capital at the height of the civil rights movement. nbc news was there and caught up with one of the march's notable participants to ask about the success of the event. here's a look inside the fault with a scene out of 1963. >> the leaders of this march are now on their way to the white house to see president kennedy, but among the dignitaries still here is dick gregory. dick, what are your feelings at this end of this long and rather exciting day? >> well, my feelings is, after being here, witnessing this, that as long as there's a man alive on the face of the earth, this day will always be remembered the world over. >> what do you think were the high spots? >> well, the high spots, to me, and i think psychologically, to many people, this was the first time in the history of this country, a group of negroes have ever been invited anywhere. >> has this been a success by the standards that the leaders have set the for themselves the before it all began? >> oh, yes, this has been a success in every form.

i don't think ever before have you been able to get these many people together from all different walks of life, one, no one has ever gathered these many people together without promising them anything. we did not come here with no promises. not even did we know where we were going to stay, if we would have enough food, if we would have enough water. and to sit and look at something that has lasted all day long, with as much love and as much feeling as this has, definitely has been a success. >> i love that interview. and when we come back, how reporting the movement helped to make the movement. but with advair, i'm breathing better. so now i can help make this a great block party. ♪ [ male announcer ] advair is clinically proven to help significantly improve lung function. unlike most copd medications, advair contains both an anti-inflammatory and a long-acting bronchodilator working together to help improve your lung function all day.

advair won't replace fast-acting inhalers for sudden symptoms and should not be used more than twice a day. people with copd taking advair may have a higher chance of pneumonia. advair may increase your risk of osteoporosis and some eye problems. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high blood pressure before taking advair. ask your doctor if including advair could help improve your lung function. [ male announcer ] advair diskus fluticasone propionate and salmeterol inhalation powder. get your first prescription free and save on refills at advaircopd.com.

no-charge scheduled maintenance. check. and here's the kicker... 0% apr for 60 months. and who got it? this guy. and who got it? this guy. and who got it? this guy. that's right... [ male announcer ] it's the car you won't stop talking about. ever. hurry in to the volkswagen best. thing. ever. event. and get 0% apr for 60 months, now until september 3rd. that's the power of german engineering. when three friends of journalist idaby welles were lynched in 1982, he responded with an investigative report debunking the myth that lynching were a response to black male's punishment against white women. her account so angered white women, they destroyed the

memphis free speech offices and ran welles from town. but even in exile, welles continued to write about southern racial violence for the chicago defender, and the chicago conservator for decades. in the 1920s, legendary civil rights activist, walter white, took investigative journalism and courage to another level. his light complexion and blue eyes allowed him to infiltrate kkk groups, gather details about lynchings and report the names and crimes of the participants. his writings were definitive in shaping northern public opinion about southern violence. welles and white are two of the earlier journalist activists, who demonstrated the power of the press to shape social movements. leaders of the mid-century civil rights movement fully understood the power of the press and they confronted jim crow in ways specifically designed to create stories and generate visual footage that would highlight the horrors of racial injustice. we remember the words of king

and the actions of men like john lewis and the risks taken by thousands of demonstrators in part because of reporters who were on the front lines, taking the pictures and recording their stories. joining the panel is jeff nielson, director of archives at the saturday evening post, and back with us is also historian, jelani cobb. in this moment, as we're about to celebrate the 50th anniversary, what is the role of the press in social and political movements? pick one role of the press. >> i think it's important, as i look across, 50 years and even longer, the big difference was that 50 years ago, the black community, the white community had this great chasm between them, and there was no communication between each other and there was, for the early reporters, there was this great area to start introducing information. there was general acceptance, every generation since then, as

each generation of reporters took up the story. but there was almost no communication. and there was no idea what black people were facing in the '50s. >> so this point of information, though, is such a -- if we go back to what we were talking about, all the way to the hillary clinton documentary question, what i wondered now, given sort of the nature of our media, is whether or not, if you report on a social movement or if you report on the horrors of injustice, if people receive it as new information that then shapes their opinion, or if they see it as simply ideologically driven by the reporters themselves. if fox news is reporting on the tea party, or if msnbc is reporting on the trayvon martin rallies, that that's actually doesn't get received as new information that ought to update my world view. >> right. i think one of the things that's interesting here is that kind of ala cart news, you know, approach, and you can get the news that you want, the news that most easily conforms to your world view. but in some ways, that's not new, kind of a throwback to the old newspaper eras, the early 20th century and the 19th

century, where people had newspapers, clearly affiliated, this idea of objectivity in journalism was far from the forefront of what people had. so okay, william randolph hurst, if you run the hurst paper, you have to take a position, if you're with the joseph pulitzer paper, you'll take the opposite lain and i think people pretty much knew that. >> the lesson is, show the picture, show the images. covering movements is covering mainstream america. you look at what happened during the civil rights movement. it was, you know, remarkable bravery of the kids in birming happ, but it was the pictures of what happened to them with the water cannons and the billy clubs that galvanized america. and it's our job to be there, whether it's in a place where the u.s. is waging war. yes, we must show the caskets coming home, not to mention the people who are considered the enemy also being killed, and also here and the march on washington, what is more powerful image? and we have to remember, also,

that it was called the march for jobs and freedom. and 50 years later, we have to have that same march. and in fact, there is going to be that. >> so this idea of showing those -- you know, when you talk about sort of that sense of changing public opinion that occurred, especially around the birmingham children's the crusade. and one of the thing we have been pushing, pushing, pushing on the show are the moral monday protests going on in north carolina. because it feels to me, like if there is any major social movement happening in the country, it is that. so every single monday in north carolina, they're coming together, it's interracial crowds. you can see the police actually arresting peaceful protesters. the crowds are growing every single week. and yet, and maybe because we've seen the march on washington, maybe because we have some familiarity with these things, it doesn't seem to strike the same -- it's not moving as quickly, it feels like to me, as those moments around the children's crusade did. >> we also have to show the facts on the ground that's

motivating this. go back to what maymy till taught us. she said in the midst of her greatest grief, she said, i want the casket open, of my little boy, 14 years old. she wanted the world to see the ravages of racism and the brutality of bigotry. it was the black publications like "jet" magazine that took photos of his distended head. we've got to show the reality, on the ground, of what's devastating this country. for example, poverty. >> but on the one hand, i'm thinking just about the body of trayvon martin, which was published by non-plaque media, and you know, kind of went viral on the internet. and even that, it was like, briefly viral. i don't know that we have a sustained attention span in the way that we used to. and also, the reality is that images can be doctored in ways that they couldn't back then. so people -- i don't know that

people even trust images the way they used to. an image used to be a definitive record. and of course, you can edit now in post. but we knew what was real in a way that we don't necessarily now. things are constantly audioswedeened, visually matched up. o.j. simpson becomes darker, you know, whatever. so i don't know there's the same -- and you look at newspapers now, they're firing entire photo divisions and saying that they're going to -- some of them. and saying the that they're going to just get free lance images. >> who needs a photo journalist when everyone has an iphone? >> exactly. so i guess a part of it is a question of, is there a will to deal with the political issues, but also the image culture was at an apex at the time of the civil rights movement in ways that it's different today. an image culture today is more associated with celebrity and with perfection, air brushing, et cetera. and i think that these very real images, like the emmett till image you're talking about, that's a different way of framing things that i don't know

would even be as resonant today. >> i still draw gasps from audiences when i show lynching photographs. so as much as that maybe images have lost certain types of power, because we all carry in our pocket, 4,000 pictures, there still are images that the hup humanity of them is so intense and so clear, that people experience them. we know there is something that papers can do, and that is to help us understand our history better, which i want to talk about, as soon as we get back. as we think about the march on washington, it is, in fact, not just about 50 years. think a hundred years. go back, go back, go back, when we come back. a? that's a great choice. let me show you some faucets to go along with that. with the latest styles and guaranteed low prices, you can turn the bath you have into the bath you want. good choice. more saving. more doing. that's the power of the home depot. right now, this abbey vanity combo

is a special buy. just $299.

does your dog food have? 18 percent? 20? new purina one true instinct has 30. active dogs crave nutrient-dense food. so we made purina one true instinct. learn more at purinaone.com as we approach the 50th anniversary of the march on washington, we are taking a look back at what actually led up to that march. one of the nation's oldest and most iconic magazines, "the saturday evening post," covered the issue of civil rights extensively in the 1950s and '60s, and in nearly ever issue in 1963. in its first retrospective

column on the march's 50th anniversary called "it's our country too," "the saturday evening post" looks at the discrimination that african-american men faced from the military in enlisting and getting jobs at the defense plants in the 1940s, before world war ii, which almost led to a march on washington in 1941. so talk to me a little bit about this part of the story that we don't always know or put at the forefront. >> that article, the "it's our country too," written by walter white for the post, was saying to roosevelt, in effect, if you say you have a manpower shortage and you're going to ignore the african-americans in this country, then you've only brought it on yourself. but he's also saying, it's time to end this. if you can at least do nothing else, end the disparity between the wages of white and black workers, and ultimately, that's what roosevelt did by an executive order, with the agreement by a. phillip randolph that we wouldn't stage that march on washington. >> in this case, it was a bit lake our current senate filibuster, right? it didn't happen, but the threat

of it was significant for this president, in the context, particularly of international aggressions and war, to say, no, don't do that, and it actually move ed public policy. >> he was concerned we wanted to have a unified look, particularly going into the war, just like kennedy was trying to tell martin luther king, don't do a march, because you're going to anger white racists. now's time to go slow, now's the time to be cautious. and king said, nope, can't do it, at which time kennedy turned around and did support, was there was still pressure from the executive office, please, don't make me look bad. >> and a reminder of how important the military comes in making this kind of claim on citizenship, both the willingness to serve in, and so many men who came back in the interwar period, there were lynchings of black men in uniform, because if you stand there in uniform, you are saying, i'm an american and i deserve a certain level of equality here. >> and i think it's an important kind of point implicit in this,

which is this narrative, the very simplistic narrative we tell ourselves, that it had to do with changing hearts and minds and this kind of evolving moral ethic and so on. but more often than not, this is about self-interest and political pragmatism. that's how we get that executive order 8802 in 1941. roval h roosevelt has other interests. this is how we get the march on washington and the kind of liberal concessions that people make, especially in the context of the cold war. we were just talking about this. >> but part of sit a requirement that we believe the press will report on it. so part of randolph's ability to get those concessions is the believe, don't embarrass us. because the press will report on it, right? and when they do, we'll have this both domestic and international effect. >> and i think it's really important to look at who organized the march on washington. you were just talking about phillip randolph. who said to fdr, describe the condition of working people and

black people in this country and fdr famously said to him, i'm not disagreeing with you, but you've got to make me do it, which has become a watch word today, and his protege, it was just announced on thursday, east going to be winning the presidential medal of freedom. >> my favorite thing that happens. >> black, gay pacifist. these are the stories that must be told. >> and out as a black man, out as a gay man, out as a pacifist, out as a communist, in that moment, and in fact, "life" magazine, their cover after the march on washington isn't of dr. king standing there giving the dream speech, it's of a. phillip randolph and ruston. >> and close adviser to dr. king. in the world of nsa right now, as soon as you start organizing the montgomery for the bus boycott, j. edgar hoover had in his sights within a month and

was starting to monitor him and surveil him. we have a lot of lessons to learn. >> i'm convinced, i mean, i'm convinced that this is part of the difference in the racial reactions to the snowden and nsa, i grew up with the assumption that the government was listening, in part because i had, you know, parents and uncles who had been involved in the movement, and because of your point about hoover, the assumption was, it was an ongoing joke about everybody's fbi file and the idea that folks were listening. >> i said to harry belafontbelaf you ever forget the numerous conversations you had with dr. king, just apply them to the freedom of information act. >> exactly! >> if you forget them, don't worry. somebody's got a transcript. i appreciate so much all of you being here. before we go, i just want to listen, in case folks don't know, a. phillip randolph, if you've never had a chance to see him or hear him, when we come back, we're going to talk to some extraordinary foot soldiers. we've got some amazing people

who have been doing work in newtown, connecticut, when we come back. but i do want you to listen to a. phillip randolph as we go to break. >> what was in your mind when you conceived of this assembly? >> well, mr. gronski, we had in mind the idea of building a massive thrust, in the interesting of awakening and arousing the consciousness of the nation on the issue of civil rights. alert.

the beach on your tv is much closer than it appears. seize the summer with up to 50% off hotels at travelocity. these are sandra's "homemade" yummy, scrumptious bars. hmm? i just wanted you to eat more fiber. chewy, oatie, gooeyness... and fraudulence. i'm in deep, babe. you certainly are. [ male announcer ] fiber one.

our foot soldiers of the week are helping to bring healing and joy in the wake of newtown tragedy. 80 kids from ages 5 to 18 are performing this weekend at newtown high school. this isn't an ordinary production.

guidance and training from several broadway professionals. the goal is to support the healing process from young people who families are affected by the december 14th tragedy and to honor those educators who lost their lives. thank you all for being here. tell me about the 1214 foundation. >> it started approximately a month after the event, after waking up from this horrible tragedy. the thought is that there is no words to describe what happened. there's got to be other ways to get this out and extresz this. i feel there's a couple of different ways. one is through architecture. there needs to be a

representation of what happened about this. the world is not okay with what happened. the way you feel when you walk into a building that's been built for a purpose is profound. there's no description of that. per fornling arts can help kids expres themselves in a way that's unique to them. it gives them confidence and self-awareness and understanding of themselves. a combination will accomplish what we want to do. >> they don't always have the vocabulary to speak in sophisticated terms about the feelings they're having in the wake of a tragedy like this. >> right. we're looking at a sdool of the performi inin inin ining arts. they need to commit and have responsibilities and build themselves from the inside out.

once you have someone that you admire and look up to and work with that person, you can say, i can be that person. all of a sudden your perspective changes. it's going to tell yourself that you can do it. >> john, my daughter for fourth grade did the musical. i said tune in at the end. i wanted her to see there's a broadway person connected with this thing. this idea of this isn't just a small school performance. this is a life opening big kind of ideal. why did you want to be involved? >> i think that like a lot of people when the events happened on december 14th, i felt helpless. when i got the call it was like often times as an actor i don't want to do this project or that project, it was literally this

yes. i wanted to make a tribute and playing the cat in the hat he's like the leader that keeps everything together. i thought working with these kids i feel like i get to be the one that pushes for the positive healing. it's also a role i've wanted to play. what better way to play it than something that will do something so positive. >> what role are you playing? >> the bird. >> some of the vocal solos for that part are amazing. tell me the extent to which you're experiencing some of what these goals were initially. >> for the show? >> yeah. >> i've always loved musical theater. my goal was to because mazy is a character in dr. seusss my goal was to really bring her to life. give the kids who are coming to see the show say woe, that's

mazy. >> there's several sort of dr. seuss stories that's part of it and one of the important ones is horton hear a who. parents and children know that's about the tiniest life mattering, the smallest person mattering. did you all talk as a cast about that? >> very much. there's a lyric that gets repeated a lot is a person's a person no matter how small. i remember thinking what a wonderful show and it was a beautiful message. i think it's heartfelt. now look at it from this perspective all of us get quiet and there's goose bumps with everybody during that lyric. last night during the opening night feeling the audience take that in was emotional. certain things that dr. seuss wrote it's almost like he knew we were going to need it for this. >> it dud take on a specific meaning for newtown that a person's a person no matter how

small. >> michael unger is the director and he focused on the performers to be 5 years old to 18 years old to not be acting but be in the part. there's not trying to be a mazy. it's claire being herself within that role. that's what's making it more are rand more powerful. >> i'm sure you're amazing amazing. >> she is. >> thank you for the work you're doing. thank you to michael and john and to claire and thanks to you at home for watching. see you tomorrow morning at 10:00 a.m. eastern. we'll take a look at the poll showing 40% white americans have white friends. come on, y'all, make friends with us. >> to my friend, melissa, there you go. the huge backlog of disability

claims facing military. this weekend marks more than four decades since the grisly murders by charles manson. i will talk to the author who looks at his childhood. the growing mayor facing pressure to resign. fast food nation. a new poll in the eating habits of americans, are you more or less inclined to grab a burger these days. i'll be right back. alk. good, 'cause i don't have time for machines. some companies just don't appreciate the power of conversation! you know, i like you! i like you too! at discover, we treat you like you'd treat you. get the it card and talk to a real person.